Transcript [00:02] Welcome to Waiting for 61, JTA's Israel [00:05] election podcast, where we break down [00:07] the fundamentals of Israel's 2026 [00:10] elections, the politics, the players, [00:12] and what's at stake as the country heads [00:13] to the polls. [00:15] I'm Ami Eden, CEO and executive editor [00:17] of 70 Faces Media, the organization [00:19] behind the Jewish Telegraphic Agency. [00:22] >> And I'm Ruth [music] Eglash, JTA's [00:24] senior Israel correspondent. Today marks [00:27] six [music] days into Israelis cast [00:28] their votes. [00:30] >> Before we begin, just a reminder to our [00:32] listeners to send any questions you'd [00:34] like us to answer to Waiting for 61 at [00:37] jta.org. Today, we're mixing things up a [00:39] bit. Rather than doing an episode with [00:42] just me and Ruth, we're excited to be [00:44] joined by Elan Levy. [00:47] Elan is a British-Israeli political [00:49] commentator, journalist, and former [00:51] spokesman for the Israeli government. [00:53] You've definitely seen him eloquently [00:56] and passionately defending Israel and [00:57] explaining Israeli politics to often [01:00] hostile interviewers across [01:02] international media. [01:03] Elan also has his own election podcast [01:06] called Elan Israel Election Cast, which [01:09] we highly recommend. So, after you [01:11] finish listening to Waiting for 61 each [01:13] day, make sure you check out Elan Israel [01:16] Election Cast. [01:17] >> Today, we're going to focus on two [01:19] issues that we're hoping Elan is going [01:21] to be able to help us understand and [01:23] better understand. And the first is [01:25] explaining why Israel's youth or [01:28] first-time voters, those who are you [01:31] know, have turned 18 and are coming to [01:33] the polls for the first time, are [01:35] expected to kind of overwhelmingly vote [01:37] right-wing, which is kind of in contrast [01:40] to other Western countries. And the [01:42] second issue, which is really Elan's [01:44] forte, is how Israel's international [01:47] standing is playing a role, if any, in [01:49] this election. And will a new government [01:52] improve the situation? Let's get into [01:54] it. Still your line, Ami. [01:57] Uh Elon, thank you so much for joining [01:59] us today. [02:01] >> Hello. [02:02] >> Hello. You've been following this [02:04] election very closely on your excellent [02:06] podcast and interviewing members from [02:08] each party about their platform and [02:10] policies. [02:12] You know, there's going to be around [02:13] half a million first-time voters since [02:16] the last election. [02:18] Who are they going to be voting for? [02:19] Reports are saying that they're all, you [02:21] know, going for Ben Gvir for the parties [02:23] on the right. Uh maybe Bennett also cuz [02:26] he's got this kind of chic young young [02:29] vibe campaign going. What's your take on [02:32] this? [02:33] >> Well, first of all, most Israelis are [02:34] going to be voting for parties on the [02:36] right with the exception of the Arab [02:38] parties, one of which is the Israeli [02:40] Communist Party. There is only one [02:42] self-proclaimed left-wing party. That's [02:45] the Democrats, the [02:46] merger of Labor and Meretz, such a small [02:48] count that those two mighty parties had [02:51] to merge in order to both survive. The [02:54] whole country has become more hawkish, [02:57] especially since October 7th, and that's [02:59] what happens when you see not only the [03:02] experiment of a territorial withdrawal [03:05] blow up in your face, but blow up in [03:07] your face with the massacre and [03:09] abduction of peace activists on the Gaza [03:12] border. So, the whole country has become [03:14] more hawkish. The left itself has become [03:17] more hawkish on security. I I [03:19] interviewed Rabbi Gilad Kariv from the [03:21] Democrats on my podcast and asked him [03:23] what's changed for him since October [03:25] 7th, and he said, and this is Israel's [03:27] left-wing party, that he used to think [03:30] we could have international forces [03:32] stationed on our eastern border in the [03:33] Jordan Valley. Now, he believes that the [03:36] IDF, the Israeli military, must remain [03:39] in the Jordan Valley, basically, [03:41] indefinitely. And when I asked him, "And [03:43] what happens if the Palestinians object [03:45] to that because that's a non-starter for [03:47] them?" He said, "Well, there's no deal." [03:48] So, the whole country has very much [03:50] shifted to the right politically, And [03:52] that's reflected especially among the [03:54] youth. [03:55] Israel's youth have grown up knowing [03:58] nothing but war and security crises. [04:02] Remember the uh people who are becoming [04:05] soldiers this year, aged 18, were 15 [04:10] when the October 7th massacre started. [04:13] This has overshadowed their formative [04:16] years. Um and that has made them tougher [04:19] on security, more closed in, more aware [04:22] of the dangers in the outside world. [04:25] Right-wing in Israel doesn't necessarily [04:27] Well, doesn't at all track the same [04:29] issues it does in the West. The The fact [04:30] they're right-wing says nothing about [04:32] their opinions about [04:34] gay rights, or abortion, or any of the [04:36] issues that would ordinarily be seen as [04:39] uh left and right. But I think that kind [04:41] of youthful idealism um [04:44] that uh will often characterize the [04:46] youth in other countries doesn't exist [04:48] in this country where people have really [04:50] been forced to um [04:52] grow up very quickly, perhaps too soon. [04:55] >> Um let me ask you this though, because [04:57] you know that you're talk You talked [04:58] about this these young people who uh are [05:01] going to serve in the army. I mean, you [05:02] would have thought after 3 years of war, [05:04] and it's been quite a brutal war by [05:06] Israel's standards. We're talking like [05:08] thousands of soldiers who have been [05:10] killed and really risking their lives [05:11] and going into these dangerous [05:12] situations. Are they not Is there not [05:15] like a tiredness? Are they not fed up [05:17] with all of this? Are they [05:18] you know, or are they still feeling very [05:20] threatened and patriotic and wanting to, [05:23] you know, continue on with this? [05:25] >> That's a great question, and I think [05:27] that Israel is torn between two [05:28] impulses. On the one hand, a tiredness, [05:32] a desire to put war behind us and move [05:35] on with our lives. But on the other [05:37] hand, [05:38] um a desire to finish the job. An [05:41] understanding that you can't keep [05:43] kicking problems down on road, that you [05:45] have to deal with problems, and that we [05:47] suffered from a generation of political [05:50] leadership that kept pushing problems [05:52] into the long grass. So, the young [05:54] generation are feeling angry, hurt by [05:57] what has happened over the last 3 years. [06:00] Um [06:01] they did not grow up with the promise of [06:06] a peace process, and those hopes only to [06:08] see them infected and that blown up. [06:11] Remember, this is a generation that grew [06:13] up. You're talking about We're in We're [06:15] in 2026, okay? So, a an 18-year-old now [06:19] was born after the second intifada. [06:22] Basically, that they are born in the [06:25] rubble of the collapse of the peace [06:26] process, and never grew up with that [06:29] hope that a process may be possible. So, [06:33] on the one hand, yes, um [06:35] they don't want to be fighting. And by [06:37] the way, that's reflected in the huge [06:39] emphasis on the Haredi enlistment issue. [06:41] The desire to spread the burden more [06:43] equally among society, so that when you [06:46] finish the army, you can get on with [06:47] your life instead of being dragged back [06:49] into military service. Uh but also a [06:52] huge anger against Israel's enemies who [06:54] are still standing, uh an understanding [06:56] of what the threat is that is still [06:57] against us, and a desire to [07:00] finish the job. And you have different [07:02] parties offering different solutions. [07:04] Some you may say is simplistic, some you [07:06] might argue are outright racist or [07:08] populistic. The parties that are [07:10] appealing to the young and saying we [07:11] need to shake things up. And what was is [07:14] not what will be. [07:15] >> Let's pivot to the other issue uh that [07:17] we wanted to talk to you about today, [07:19] and that's really in many ways your [07:21] specialty and what you're known for, um [07:24] is Israel's international standing, [07:26] which has really never been lower. [07:29] Um you've complained about hasbara. I [07:31] don't I don't know how exactly to put [07:32] that in English, but you sort of Israeli [07:35] government um [07:38] public relations, messaging, etc. Are [07:41] Israelis talking about this problem in [07:44] the election? Like, is this part of the [07:47] discourse and what could sway votes in [07:50] the question of would a different [07:52] government do a better job of [07:54] strengthening Israel's international [07:56] standing versus the current, you know, [07:58] Netanyahu block? [08:00] >> Yeah, the question of public diplomacy [08:01] comes up, but indirectly. It's part of [08:04] the broader question of rehabilitating [08:06] Israel's international standing, its [08:08] foreign relations, not in and of itself. [08:11] There is no one who is voting based on [08:14] I'm going to vote because I think this [08:15] person will make the world like us. Uh [08:18] that is not a goal in itself for [08:20] Israelis. It's who can manage relations [08:22] with the world so that we can achieve [08:25] our national interests. Now, within that [08:27] there is a range of opinion and it's [08:30] been fascinating to pose these questions [08:32] to the different political parties and [08:34] see how they engage. On the far right, [08:37] you have Otzma Yehudit Ben-Gvir's party, [08:40] whose approach is basically own the [08:42] libs, okay? We're going to walk around [08:45] wearing a hangman's noose because it [08:47] makes us look badass and we're [08:49] impressing the people who just want to [08:51] be bad to the bad guys. And screw the [08:55] woolly-hearted soft liberals if they [08:57] don't like it. We're talking the [08:59] language of the Middle East and they can [09:00] go to hell, okay? That's basically the [09:02] approach of the far right in in that [09:04] perspective. I think the [09:07] uh position on the left may be equally [09:10] detached from reality. [09:12] Um I think there is [09:14] a belief on the left that if Israel uh [09:18] starts behaving like a normal country [09:21] and doesn't have ministers who say [09:24] aggressive nonsense, that Israel's [09:26] relations will snap back to normal. And [09:29] I think there is maybe a denial there of [09:31] how much public opinion has shifted [09:33] against Israel and how much the [09:34] expectations of policy makers have [09:36] shifted as well, that even they won't be [09:38] able to address that. [09:40] And then in the middle you have those [09:42] who say, "Look, we have to fight against [09:45] the information war against us, but also [09:47] understand that there are realistic [09:49] limits on what we can achieve." So, you [09:51] know, I sat down with Naftali Bennett, [09:52] who said, "Look, but the world's not [09:54] going to like us, okay? We can fight [09:57] against the information war that Qatar [09:58] is waging, and we're going to do that by [10:00] designating Qatar as an enemy state. [10:02] We'll fight for more screen time on [10:05] international television. And the best [10:07] thing we can do," he said, "is if we [10:08] stop having stupid ministers who say [10:10] stupid things and end up turning the [10:12] world against us. A lot of the damage in [10:13] this war was self-inflicted. A lot of it [10:16] had nothing to do with us, okay? [10:17] Politicians like the president who are [10:18] quoted completely out of context by UN [10:21] commissions of inquiry, but there's been [10:22] a lot of self-inflicted damage as well." [10:25] Um the real question is [10:28] to what extent any belief that uh [10:32] Israel's public diplomacy is something [10:34] after the fact that we'll do what's [10:37] right for us, and then we'll find a way [10:38] to spin it and explain it to the rest of [10:40] the world. And to what extent they think [10:41] that maybe our actions should be guided [10:44] by [10:45] uh considerations about what public [10:47] opinion is going to say. But I think [10:50] there's pretty much a quite a broad [10:52] consensus within Israel. [10:54] And this is true, by the way, even in uh [10:56] the party that is the only party that's [10:58] actually really running explicitly on a [11:00] promise of public diplomacy, which is Am [11:03] Chai Yisrael, Ofer Winters' party. Uh [11:05] whose number two, Yoav Gallant, says [11:07] Hadad says, "I want to be the Hasbara [11:09] minister. I want to be the public [11:11] diplomacy minister. This is why you [11:12] should vote for me, because I'm going to [11:14] be the face of this country." And even [11:16] they are not saying that maybe we should [11:20] um reconsider policies based on how they [11:22] look around the world. There's an [11:23] understanding that there is a hostility, [11:25] there is an implacable hostility. We [11:26] have to work with our friends, we have [11:28] to work with our allies, we have to [11:29] explain ourselves better, but we can't [11:31] let being liked by the world or trying [11:34] to find favor in their eyes guide [11:36] Israel's national security policy. It's [11:39] absolutely a secondary issue to the [11:42] question of hard power, but an important [11:45] secondary issue. And I wouldn't downplay [11:47] the desire from the parties in the [11:49] opposition block to rehabilitate [11:51] relations with the West by saying, [11:53] "Look, we're just going to stop talking [11:55] like cartoon villains." [11:57] And that will already allow us to get [12:00] part of the benefit of the doubt and [12:02] some of the credit that we've recklessly [12:04] thrown away. [12:06] >> So, do you think I mean you mentioned it [12:07] already when you said when you spoke to [12:09] when you you talked about the people who [12:10] are on the parties on the left. I mean a [12:13] lot of a lot of the vilifying is against [12:15] Prime Minister Netanyahu directly. And [12:18] so, if he's not in office, could that [12:21] change? Could Israel's image change? And [12:23] also, you mentioned Ben-Gvir and the [12:25] characters on the right. [12:26] >> If we end up with the same government, [12:29] then Israel's international image is not [12:31] going to improve. Netanyahu is now [12:34] promising that Ben-Gvir will remain a [12:36] senior government minister in his next [12:39] coalition. And he will continue doing [12:42] provocations that are going to drag [12:44] Israel further and further into um into [12:49] further disgrace. [12:50] The question is whether an alternative [12:53] government would [12:56] suddenly magically boost Israel's [12:58] international standing. And I don't [12:59] think it will. I think a more moderate [13:01] government will buy Israel some [13:03] goodwill, definitely among those who [13:07] say, "In theory, we support Israel. We [13:08] don't like Netanyahu." They've allowed [13:10] Netanyahu to take the fall for a lot of [13:12] military operations that whoever was in [13:14] power was going to have to do, right? [13:16] Whoever was in power after October 7th, [13:18] Gaza was going to look like a disaster [13:19] zone. Um and would certainly buy allow [13:23] Israel to get a bit more goodwill, but [13:26] we have to understand [13:28] the world has, or at least the West has [13:31] shifted far beyond what even the Israeli [13:34] left can accept. So, when [13:37] Ed Miliband announces sanctions, not [13:40] because of the settler violence, Jewish [13:43] terrorism, zealous [13:45] uh anarchism, whatever we want to call [13:47] it, but because of settlement [13:48] construction, [13:50] whoever the next Prime Minister is is [13:52] going to find himself on a collision [13:53] course because they're going to say, [13:54] "We're not changing that. [13:56] We're not freezing construction in East [13:58] Jerusalem, which is what you are [13:59] expecting us to do. We'll fight against [14:01] the settler violence, but that [14:03] settlement construction is going to [14:04] continue." Um and I I put this to to [14:07] Rabbi Carib from the Democrat Party as [14:09] well. I said, "What are you going to do [14:11] when there's a Democratic [14:12] administration? [14:14] You walk into the Oval Office and [14:15] President AOC says, 'Wow, finally a [14:19] left-wing government. Good. Let's do [14:21] that Palestinian state we were talking [14:23] about. Withdraw to '67. Get all the [14:25] settlers out.' And you say, 'Madam [14:26] President, we can't do that.' [14:29] Um I think the world is going to [14:31] understand that a lot of the problems [14:32] that they blame on Netanyahu are not [14:34] Netanyahu. It's Israel taking a more [14:36] aggressive, assertive security posture [14:39] in the region because we understand we [14:42] cannot have [14:43] um terrorists on our borders. We need to [14:47] um maintain that control in Judea and [14:49] Samaria. And a another government will [14:51] definitely avoid the [14:53] needless provocations and totally [14:56] avoidable crises and self-damage that [15:00] this government has inflicted, um [15:03] but will still find itself on a pretty [15:05] firm collision course unless there is an [15:07] alternative vision they're able to [15:08] promote and and try to get foreign [15:10] leaders behind. [15:12] >> Before we wrap up, I wanted to bring the [15:14] two issues together. [15:16] Um [15:16] you know, you talked about how there is [15:18] a sense among first-time voters, younger [15:20] Israeli voters, [15:22] an anger [15:23] that these problems weren't addressed in [15:27] you know, in a meaningful way. [15:28] And presumably by voting for more [15:31] right-wing candidates, their first [15:33] priority is [15:34] address the situation, not put them [15:37] somewhat in the camp of not overly [15:39] worrying about the what the world [15:41] thinks. [15:42] At the same time though, [15:45] I'm wondering I'm I'm thinking about [15:47] when the Prime Minister talked about [15:48] Israel might need to be Sparta. And I'm [15:51] thinking of my younger relatives across [15:53] the political spectrum. No you know, no [15:55] matter how right-wing they are, [15:57] many of them I think still would want an [16:00] Israel that is engaging with the world. [16:03] They want to travel around the world. [16:05] They want to [16:06] you know, unless [16:07] unless they're like going to be in [16:08] Yeshivas um [16:10] all the time, they're going to want to [16:11] be doing business in the world. There's [16:13] a dynamism to Israel's culture and [16:15] economy [16:17] and engagement with the world that I [16:18] think they would want to see continue. [16:20] Is it is it is that a real tension, you [16:22] know, in term for for younger voters? Am [16:24] I reading that right? [16:25] >> Look, the the success of the far right [16:27] is not because people want issues to be [16:29] dealt with and as if I'm suggesting that [16:30] these are the only parties that are [16:31] going to deal with it. But they're [16:32] offering simplistic solutions, okay? [16:34] When you are leading school children in [16:38] chance of death to terrorists and your [16:40] solution is look, we're just going to [16:41] kill them. It's a simplistic solution [16:44] that appeals to people's basis instincts [16:47] and has an appeal among [16:50] has an appeal among [16:52] among 18-year-olds. It's not the [16:53] majority. [16:54] Bennett it looks like will manage to do [16:57] very well among the youth because of a [16:59] very effective campaign. [17:02] His campaign is very down-to-earth, very [17:05] grounded. Gen Z hate things that feel [17:09] manipulated or artificial. And his [17:12] campaign is all about him sitting at [17:14] cafes in random towns holding what [17:16] Israelis call parliamentum [17:18] where he just sits down at a cafe [17:20] orders everything on the menu and [17:22] invites people who are heckling him [17:23] passing by to sit down and let's talk [17:25] about it and to persuade people. I think [17:27] that [17:28] campaign is having inroads but Israeli [17:30] youth are absolutely looking at the [17:32] question of [17:34] what kind of world we want to live in, [17:35] what kind of world is going to be safe [17:38] for us and I think there is [17:40] anger about the outside world as well [17:42] and the way they've handled this war and [17:44] they don't understand and the way that [17:45] they've become extreme and sided with [17:47] Israel's enemies. [17:49] Um but as always for first-time voters [17:51] there will be a mix of emotions not [17:54] always coherent not always entirely [17:56] consistent [17:58] um that will be driving [18:00] their first vote in in what will be [18:02] let's emphasize the most fateful [18:04] elections in Israel's history. These are [18:06] the first elections after the October [18:08] 7th massacre after the tragedy that has [18:11] redefined and reshaped this country. So [18:15] a lot to play for and I don't know how [18:17] many of them have finally made their [18:18] minds up and how many will do so in the [18:19] final stretch. [18:21] >> I I wanted to say one more thing maybe [18:23] just to contribute to what Elon was [18:24] saying. I think that you know listeners [18:27] have to keep in mind that Israeli youth [18:29] are very different to youth outside of [18:32] Israel. You know at age of 18 they go to [18:34] the army. They're giving this ultimate [18:36] sacrifice where they're going to fight [18:38] for their country and so they're very [18:40] aware of the politics. It's not like an [18:42] 18-year-old who's about to go to college [18:44] and doesn't really isn't really paying [18:46] attention to the politics around them. [18:48] In Israel it's like young people are [18:50] very aware of what's going on and [18:52] they're very political and very involved [18:54] in the political scene. [18:55] >> And and by the way I'll I'll point out [18:57] one more thing. [19:00] Israel's electoral system [19:02] makes it very difficult for new young [19:05] talent to get involved in the political [19:08] system [19:09] because we have a [19:12] system of proportional representation [19:14] where the whole country is one district [19:18] and a threshold of 3.25% [19:20] to get in. [19:21] Which might not sound like a lot, but [19:24] it's about 150,000 votes. That's a very [19:27] high bar, especially when new parties [19:32] are limited in how much they can fund [19:34] raise from donors and the existing [19:36] parties get [19:38] funding taxpayer funding from the [19:40] Knesset. [19:41] It means that if young people want to [19:44] get involved in the election, they only [19:46] have three options. One is to found [19:49] their own party, which is not realistic. [19:52] It's a really high hurdle. The next is [19:55] to join the list of an existing [19:58] politician, someone who's been there [19:59] forever. We still have many leaders have [20:01] been there since the '90s. Um and the [20:05] third is to, you know, run in the two [20:06] parties that still have primaries. So, [20:09] there are parties that have picked young [20:11] candidates to try to appeal to the youth [20:12] vote. Bennett has Yonatan Shalev who's [20:15] 23 or 24 on his list to appeal to the [20:18] youth vote. Um uh Aviv Ezra on Winter's [20:22] list. But Israel has a political system [20:24] that makes it very difficult for [20:27] the youth as youth to organize. So, [20:30] there isn't like a youth party or a [20:32] youth block. You have much older [20:34] politicians trying to bring on star [20:36] talent to try to capture that section of [20:38] public opinion. [20:40] >> That's it for today. [20:42] Thank you to Elan Levy for joining us [20:45] and thanks to our producer Myra Rackoff. [20:47] Please make sure to join us tomorrow for [20:49] the next episode of Waiting for 61 and [20:51] don't forget to send your questions in [20:53] to waitingfor61@jta.org. [20:56] >> And let me just hijack that and say [20:58] um [20:59] on the Israel election cast, I've [21:01] interviewed candidates from all the [21:03] major parties except for the Arab [21:05] parties, the Haredim, and the Likud, [21:07] which pulled out at the last minute and [21:09] isn't sending a candidate. I hope that [21:10] changes as at the moment there is no [21:12] Likud candidate, very disappointing, but [21:14] it's on YouTube, Spotify, Apple [21:15] Podcasts. Conversations about policy, [21:18] not politics. We go through their [21:19] manifestos if they have one. So, all [21:21] anyone who really wants to get into the [21:23] weeds, um [21:25] then please listen to that podcast, [21:26] okay? [21:27] >> Sounds good. Thank you again for being [21:28] here, Elon. My pleasure. Thank you. [21:37] >> [music] [21:44] [music]
